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The Newfoundland Dog and Newf-L F.A.Q.

4. Newf-L Courtesy

4.1 Basic Courtesy

Try to remember that you are speaking to a group. Would you get up on a stage and yell at someone in front of 1000 other people? Probably not. If you have a problem with someone, respond to them privately and not to the list.

Not everyone reads their mail one message at a time. Some people get the list in "digest form", and some download all the messages at once to peruse later. Bearing this in mind, please keep your messages to a reasonable length, and do not send pictures with your messages.

Remember that not everyone uses the same mail package as you to get their mail. Some people still use terminals with nothing but a Unix prompt and no windows at all (Believe it or not, even in 2009 I prefer this.) If your e-mail software has some cool features like sending sound, please turn them off as most of the people that will see your message will not be able to take advantage of them.

Think of communications on this list as polite conversation. It is easy to feel powerful behind an anonymous keyboard, where you are not face to face with the person you are speaking to. You should always be courteous and polite, and behave in a manner similar to that in which you would at any other community event. Respect your fellow listers, for they are human too.

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4.2 What is Lurking?

Lurking is Net-Slang for only reading posts to a list or newsgroup, and never posting to it. Someone that belongs to the list but from whom we never (or rarely) hear is considered to be a Lurker.

Lurking is not a bad thing. In fact the majority of the people that belong to Newf-L rarely post. Most people are happy to just sit back and enjoy the stories, and learn from the conversations that occur.

When first joining an Internet mailing list or newsgroup, it is a good idea to lurk for a while to learn what types of messages are acceptable, and what types are not. Most lists and groups frown on posting for sale messages, though some do allow it. By lurking, you can get a feel for the "atmosphere" of the group with which you wish to converse.

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4.3 Posting your first message

After lurking for a while, you find a topic that you would like to give some input to. Great! Before you send that first message, it's good idea to send a new message (not a reply) to the group stating who you are, why you like Newfs, who your Newfs are... An introduction to a large group of people. This way, you will be someone we all know, rather than a stranger that burst into the conversation.

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4.4 Posting messages from your dog

Posting messages from the viewpoint of your dog is something that happens on Newf-L from time to time. Some of us love it, and some of us hate it. In order not to get flamed by those that dislike doggie-postings, the group came to an agreement that all such posts should contain the word "WOOF", in the subject, preferably at the beginning.

For example, if I wanted to post a message from my dog on the virtues of eating remote controls, I would create my new message with a subject line along the lines of:

[WOOF!] Remote Controls are Sooo Yummy!

This is now considered common courtesy, so beware if you post this type of message without the WOOF.

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4.5 Posting show results for your dog (Brags)

Along the same lines as the WOOF message are the BRAGs. Many people do not wish to read how well your dog did at the latest dog show, and many people seek those messages out. In order to help the reader determine what type of message is hidden behind your subject line, these codes came about.

If you wish to post the results of your Newf in the show ring or obedience trials or anywhere else for that matter, please include the word BRAG in your subject line, preferably at the beginning. For example:

[BRAG!] Ch. Breeders Rover is now Champion!

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4.6 Posting messages that are off-topic

From time to time someone needs to start a thread which is not strictly related to the world of Newfoundlands. Off-Topic posts should be kept to a minimum, but if you feel the need, please prefix your subject line with NON-NEWF or OT (for Off Topic). For example:

NON-NEWF: Looking for St. Bernard rescue info

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4.7 Posting messages in HTML format

Some e-mail programs are capable of sending e-mail messages formatted in HTML (The programming language of web pages). Please turn this option off. Remember, not everyone can read a message formatted like that. All they will see is cryptic codes, and you will likely get flamed. If you absolutely refuse to turn off this feature (It is pretty cool when it works), most of the offending e-mail packages will let you specify who can and cannot receive this type of encoding. Simply turn of HTML messages for the Newf-L address.

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4.8 Posting messages IN ALL CAPS

Posting messages in all caps is CONSIDERED VERY RUDE. IT IS HARD ON THE EYES AND IS CONSIDERED SCREAMING! Get the idea? Please post all messages in normal lower case text, using all caps for emphasis or where otherwise normally used, such as abbreviations or acronyms.

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4.9 Posting pictures or other attachments

Posting pictures to Newf-L is severely frowned upon. Remember, there are people that download ALL the Newf-L messages once a day for off-line reading. When pictures, which are often sizable, are posted, they cause the download time to get excessive.

Some people also get charged for the amount of data they retrieve. For them to get charged for an unsolicited picture, that they may not even care about, tends to make them cranky.

Simply put, please do not post attachments of any kind, including, but not limited to; pictures, programs, greeting cards, documents, spreadsheets, or any other thing you might be tempted to attach to your e-mail.

If you would like to share pictures of your Newf or event, please don't hesitate to do so. The proper manner in which this should be accomplished is either:

1) Send an e-mail to Newf-L saying something to the effect of "I have pictures of my Newfie, anyone that would like to see them, please reply in private and I will e-mail you a copy".

2) Prepare a web page with the pictures and post the URL of this page to the list.

3) Join Newf.Net and post yout pictures there.

4.10 Posting jokes

Posting jokes to Newf-L is frowned upon, unless of course it's a Newf related joke.

4.11 Posting virus alerts

Please do not post a message that claims to warn about some new virus. These message circulate often around the Internet and are usually hoaxes. These messages usually look very official, and seem to come from someone important at IBM, or a friend that knew someone that saw it happen to someone else or some other garbage.

Remember, these virus alert messages are hoaxes. They have been posted to Newf-L (an everywhere else on the 'net), about 10,000 times already. Posting one yourself will most likely get you flamed.

If you have what you think is a valid Virus Alert you would like to share with your friends on Newf-L, please check out some of these sites and see if it is listed there. Some sites update more frequently than others, so please check them all if you don't find what you're looking for.


• http://ciac.llnl.gov/ciac/CIACHoaxes.html
• http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/hoax.html
• http://www.datafellows.com/news/hoax/
• http://www.stiller.com/hoaxes.htm

These sites keep an up-to-date list of all virus hoaxes circulating on the net. Save your self from getting flamed by checking out these excellent sites first.

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4.12 Replying to messages

When replying to a message from Newf-L, you should only reply to the sender. The only time you should reply to both the sender and the list, is if your reply might benefit everyone else on the list. For example if someone asks about the symptoms of bloat, and you know the answer, posting to the list would be OK, because everyone (on Newf-L) should know the symptoms of bloat.

Another note on replying: If your e-mail software lets you include the message you are replying to please only include the relevant part of the original message in your reply. For example:

Someone posts a message:

Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah

I like Poodles!

And you decide to reply:

> Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
> Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
> Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
> Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
> Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
> Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah

> I Like Poodles!

I like Poodles, but Newfies are nicer!

This is considered rude on the 'Net.

You made the person you replied to (and possibly everyone on the list) read a pile of garbage that had nothing to do with your reply. The better alternative is to remove what does not apply:

You thoughtfully reply:

[---Snip---]

> I Like Poodles!

I like Poodles, but Newfies are nicer!

In Summary:

Please do not quote an entire message in your reply. Instead, quote only the part of the message to which you are replying.

In a similar vein, please don't snip the whole message in your reply! If you don't give a clue as to what you are replying to, the person reading your message may have no idea what part of the original message you are referring to.

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4.13 Grammar and spelling

This topic rears its ugly head from time to time, and tends to get ugly. Many people feel that anytime a word is printed for others to see, proper grammar should be used, and spelling should always be correct. Many other people feel that Newf-L is an informal conversation, and as such, proper spelling and grammar can be considered a bonus, but not a necessity.

Here's the deal. Not everyone on Newf-L is from an English speaking region. Ergo, not all Newf-L members learned English as their first language. Anyone who knows more than one language knows that English is one of the oddest, most difficult languages to master.

That being said, proper spelling and grammar may not be so easy for everyone that participates in Newf-L. While it is certainly considered to be "proper" in most circles, it most certainly cannot be mandatory, especially in the world-wide community of the Internet.

Spelling errors are most certainly going to happen, and grammar? Well, most people tend to write the way they speak. Think about that for a minute. Would you stop someone you hardly knew in mid-conversation to correct their grammar? I sure hope not. Don't do it on Newf-L either.

While well-written prose and correct spelling are certainly admirable, public, or even private correction of a strangers writing habits are not. In fact, pointing out spelling and grammatical corrections is simply rude, and has no place on Newf-L. Regardless of what you may think, if you feel the need to correct someone else's grammar or spelling, you will hurt that person's feelings, and that person will forever consider you an arrogant jerk. Perhaps not the goal you had in mind, but people are funny that way.

Be courteous and be nice. Everything else will take care of itself.

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4.14 What is SPAM?

The term SPAM comes from a Monty Python skit. If you know Monty Python, then you know to what I refer.

In Internet parlance, SPAM is many things. SPAM is posting advertisements to newsgroups or mailing lists. SPAM is cross-posting a single message to many newsgroups or mailing lists. the term SPAM is sometimes used for any post that has nothing to do with the subject at hand, though this is really a misuse of the term (If you can misuse a fabricated term).

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4.15 What is a Troll?

The term "Troll" is Net-Slang for a person that purposely posts an inflammatory or offensive message to a public newsgroup or mailing list in hopes of eliciting a response from as many people as possible. This person is trolling for responses if you will. A person that sends a "I want to buy dogs for radiation experiments" to alt.dog.rescue is most likely a troll.

A troll is generally an adolescent, though sometimes someone will troll, and put in a phone number of someone they wish to get revenge on. This is particularly nasty, as an innocent party will be the brunt of many unknowing, but well-meaning angry people.

What can be done about trolls? Ignore them. They thrive on angry responses. When they get none, they move on to better feeding grounds.

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4.16 What is a Flame?

The term "Flame" is Net-Slang for abusive and/or excessive retaliatory messages sent in reply to a person thought to be in need of a scolding. The Internet is a haven for people that would never speak out in public, but love to bash people that make even the smallest of errors on-line. For Example:

Someone posts a question to Newf-L

Are Newf's and Saint Barnards the same?

Someone flames them by replying

What are you stupid? Not only has that question been beaten to death 1000 times already, but you had the complete lack of intelligence to spell "Barnard" with an "a". It's St. Bernard you thoughtless dolt. Maybe you should spend more time at the library before you turn on your daddy's computer again.

Flames are often cruel and personal. If you get flamed, you may have made an honest mistake, or asked a question that's been asked to death, or maybe you just posted at the wrong time when someone was cranky. Try not to take it personally. The Internet is a wild place, with few rules and even fewer ways to enforce them. Sometimes you will get flamed for posting a less-than-popular belief. Generally though, if you have the knowledge to back up your position, a lively debate will ensue.

Sometimes people get so angered by a flame that they send one back. This childish game is referred to as a "flame war". Resist the urge. Sending flames is the mark of an insecure person with nothing better to do than insult other people with no power to retaliate.

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4.17 Can I reply to a message and just say "Me too/I agree/That was funny"?

Doing so to the List is considered rude, and will likely get you flamed.

Sometimes though, all you need to say is "me too", or "add me to the list". If so, reply TO THE SENDER, and not to all recipients. This way whomever needs to know that "you agree" will, and the list can go about its business.

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4.18 I keep seeing things like IMHO, LOL, , ROTFL. What do they mean?

These are abbreviations often used on the Internet. They started as a sort of shorthand for e-mail and quickly grew into almost a dialect of their own. A list of the more common ones include:



IMO	in my opinion
IMHO	in my humble/honest opinion
OTOH	on the other hand
BTW	by the way
FWIW	for what it's worth
IOW	in other words
FAQ	frequently asked questions
LOL	laughing out loud
ROTFL	rolling on the floor laughing
AFIK	as far as I know
TTYL	talk to you later
[G]	grin
[RBG]	really big grin
YMMV	your milage may vary


For a more complete list of acronyms, do an Internet search for email acronyms or texting shorthand

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4.19 What are emoticons (smileys)?

Emoticons, or more commonly "smileys" are a string of characters, assembled to look like a face when you tilt your head to one side (usually the left). They are generally included to help ensure that a post is taken lightly if the text of the message can be misconstrued as serious or damaging.

Some examples:



:-)	Smiling
;-)	Winking
:^)	Pointy nose smiley
:-P	Tongue hanging out
8-)	Smiley with glasses
<:-)	Wearing a dunce cap
>-)	Devilish grin


Want to see more emoticons than you thought could ever exist? Download a rediculously large list here: emoticon.txt.

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4.20 Is there anything I should not post to Newf-L?

Never, under any circumstance, should you post "How to make money quick" ads, or any "for sale" ads. In fact, ads of any kind are pretty much not allowed, unless you have a new Newf-related store opening you'd like to promote. Remember, Newf related is generally OK. Anything else is suspect.

Never, under any circumstance, post a "Newf for sale" message. This is in very poor taste and will get you flamed. See "Can I Look for Breeders or Rescue Contacts on Newf-L?" later in this section.

This cannot be said enough. Be courteous, be kind, and be understanding. Try to be like your Newfie (if you've got one).

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4.21 Can I Look for Breeders or Rescue Contacts on Newf-L?

When you post to Newf-L, everyone that is subscribed gets a copy. Cool huh? Think about this; Is there any mechanism to prevent someone running a puppy mill or someone looking for animals for experimentation from subscribing to Newf-L? Nope.

There was an instance not long ago where someone on Newf-L posted a message saying they liked Newfs because they were a good size for said person's odd sexual fetishes. Personally I was outraged and disgusted by the post, as were most listers. A Flame war ensued. Lets think of the more disturbing implications...

People like this may very well still subscribe to Newf-L. There is no way to prevent it. Do these people get their dogs from breeders? Probably not. More likely they scour the newsgroups and mailing lists for posts like "Newf in XX state in shelter". This twisted person goes to the shelter, pays the nominal charge and now has the partner of his dreams... Did I mention that this person never needed to reply to the original post on Newf-L? The Internet is a very cool place isn't it?

Is this an extreme example? You bet, but I did not make up the "fetish poster" story. It did happen. They are out there.

Looking for a breeder in your area is another potentially dangerous activity to do on the Internet. If you send out a message saying "I am looking for reputable breeders in my state", how do you know you will only get reputable breeders responding? You don't. Maybe you'll get a puppy mill masquerading as a reputable breeder. How will you know the difference?

The best breeder for you may not subscribe to Newf-L and if they do, there is a good chance they won't respond to your post. Think about it. Would a breeder with a great reputation sell over the Internet based on an e-mail contact? I sure wouldn't. When I first called my breeder, she wanted to know who I was, how I got her number, why I was calling etc. Newf breeders are known for only selling to people they think will provide a great home for their pups. Many breeders will only sell to people they have come to trust. They cannot determine this over the 'net. Heck, I won't even refer people to my breeder unless I can personally vouch for them!

OK, you're sufficiently frightened - So what do you do?

If you know of a dog in need of rescue, or want to get a rescue yourself, first check out the NCA at http://www.newfdogclub.org. You can also search this FAQ for rescue contact information. If you still cannot find the information you need, post a message stating that you would like to talk to the rescue contact in your area - nothing more. Do not say you know of such and such a Newf in need in whatever state.

Looking for breeders should be done in a similar way. Though there are no breeders lists in this FAQ, the NCA (http://www.newfdogclub.org) can get you started here as well. If you want a Newf, then you need to get yourself to some Newf functions. Better to post a question asking for Newf clubs in your area. Go to a Newf event, make some Newf friends and take it from there.

Getting a Newf is not, nor should it be, and easy thing to do. Do your homework and learn all you can before you go looking for that perfect Newfoundland. You'll be glad you did.

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